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1Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty My Bike will not start Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:43 pm

MikeK100

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Hi Guys

My K100 has decided not to start, the ignition lights
are all illuminated, the battery has life but when I push the starter
button....Nada..nothing ..not even a whimper. I tried putting power to
the starter direct and this turned the engine over, so I guess it must
be an electrical problem somewhere.

HEEEEEEEEEEEEEEELP please I posted this in engine and tranny problems but just figured out it should be here...Crazy Frog has given me some tips but so far...not working.

Mike Very Happy

    

2Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty My Bike will not start Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:11 pm

sojelade

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Hi Mike,

I had similar problem last week with my K100RT but it had had intermittent problem for a while starting after many tries. I thought it might be a starter motor problem so I stripped the starter motor and clean the brush connection but to no avail. I did have a look at the starter button this evening and clean the connection be dismantling the starter switch gear and cleaning it with button connections. On putting it together again it worked fine. This shows that a collection of dirt limited the contact area on the starter button resulting in the bike not starting when the button is pressed as applying power directly to the starter motor show the issue is with the starter button.

If this does not cure it I will suggest you check the basics as well like none of the fuses are blown.

Regards

Sojelade

    

3Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Mon Aug 24, 2009 6:57 pm

MikeK100

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Hi Sojelade

Thanks for the tip I will try that out tomorrow and let you know if it worked.

I did check the fuses, they all seem OK.
Mike

    

4Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Mon Aug 24, 2009 8:17 pm

Crazy Frog

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You an find a good document (in German) but with a lot of pictures in the download section (under the electrical section).

Bert

    

5Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 4:00 am

K-BIKE

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Hi Mike,
I guess you have tried all the obvious ones like kill switch not clicked over have you tried a test light the ones with a wire with a croc clip on the end which you clip to a good earth and the other to probe, just to see if when you try to start if any power is getting to the starter relay.
Regards,
K-BIKE

    

6Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 2:18 pm

MikeK100

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Here are some pictures of the K100 wiring and relay box, if you can help by letting me know which bits are relevant I would appreciate it.
Mike
My Bike will not start Relay_11
My Bike will not start Wire_c10

    

7Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 3:50 pm

Crazy Frog

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Mike, the starter relay coils is the orange plug on the back relay (beside the green flasher unit).

You should visit the download page as there is a nice drawing of the layout of the electrical box .

Bert

    

8Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 4:03 pm

MikeK100

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Thanks Bert

When I put the tester on this I get a reading of .33volts and when I push the starter button nothing changes, I tried holding the clutch in to see if this made a reading change but 🇳🇴

No power coming to the start relay.

Whats next bounce

    

9Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 5:06 pm

sojelade

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Hi Mike,

Have you dismantle and check the starter button assembly yet ? if you are not getting anything at the relay when you press the starter button I will try checking and cleaning the contacts int the start assembly first. I might be wrong but I spent some time looking everywhere else like you before I came back to check it. Take screw 3 out and you can see the connection on the back of 2. Clean the contact as dust can accumulate in there which was what my problem was.


My Bike will not start 19



Cheers

Sojelade

    

10Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 6:00 pm

MikeK100

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Sojelade

Thank you for the diagram I will try this next and I will let you know how I get on.
Regards

Mike

    

11Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 6:45 pm

Crazy Frog

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Again, the download page has pictures of the procedure to open the right handle bars switch. This is in German but the author has done a very nice job and pictures of the step by step dismantling should be enough for you to accomplish the task.

By the way, this is nice to see Soji (Sojelade) back among us. He did an awesome renovation on his K100.
Bert

    

12Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:51 pm

phil_mars

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Hi Mike,

Another thing to check just out of interest is do you have 12V on the front (high current) terminal of the starter relay with just the ignition on. On mine it was low due to poor contacts in the ignition switch and causing all sorts of grief.

I believe that is the 12V line from the load shed relay which drops out when the starter engages.

Essentially you need clutch switch, or neutral switch, ignition switch and kill switch all to be working perfectly before the starter relay will engage properly.

Regards,

Phil

    

13Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 5:36 am

MikeK100

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Phil
Today I will be checking Cool all these things...fingers crossed

    

14Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:25 am

MikeK100

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Hi
I took off the starter push button and cleaned up all the connections, I connected the tester to the 2 power connections at the back and the voltage showed just over 1 volt as in the picture, when I pushed the starter button this dropped to Zero...? I then tested the voltage with the clutch pulled in and the voltage went to just over 2 volts but still zero'd when I pushed the starter.

Does this give anyone a clear picture of what is wrong? cheers

    

15Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:29 am

MikeK100

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My Bike will not start Piccy110 This is the starter push out of the unit

My Bike will not start Piccy_10This is the rear view of the starter in the unit
My Bike will not start Piccy310This is a close up of the 2 wires that the starter push contacts with when pushed

My Bike will not start Piccy410This is the voltage across those 2 wire with the ignition on

My Bike will not start Piccy510The zero reading is what happens when I push the starter button



Last edited by MikeK100 on Wed Aug 26, 2009 8:33 am; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : added wording)

    

16Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 9:18 am

MikeK100

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Phil

I checked the voltage at the starter relay it showed 11.53 volts.
My Bike will not start Piccy610

    

17Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 10:38 am

MikeK100

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Finally a good news story, I checked and took apart every connection on the bike and tried the starter, then I checked the one shown and
Yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee! she turned over.

I would like to say that I now know more about my K100 than I did before.
Thanks to all for their help and patience, I can now sit down and enjoy my lunch.My Bike will not start This_i10
My Bike will not start Me10

    

18Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 2:05 pm

Bruce

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Hold it a minute, thats not the shirt you wore doing all that work!!

    

19Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 2:27 pm

MikeK100

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Hi Bruce
You should have seen the 4 other shirts I was wearing... Very Happy ..oily rags now.

You just cannot get enough decent cloth for cleaning your bike can you!

I would like a few tips on cleaning the metal on this bike to make it look a bit more respectable. sunny

    

20Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty My K1, 1990 will not start Wed Aug 26, 2009 9:50 pm

franklinjb

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My K1 will not start, it just back fires once or twice and then nothing, help!

    

21Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Thu Aug 27, 2009 6:19 am

Crazy Frog

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Can you let us know what you have already checked on the bike?
Ignition, fuel supply, air filter ?


__________________________________________________
My Bike will not start Frog15My Bike will not start Logo2101986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML GT2 sidecar, 1999 K1200lt/Hannigan Astro Sport sidecar.
    

22Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Thu Aug 27, 2009 6:35 am

Crazy Frog

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MikeK100 wrote:
I would like a few tips on cleaning the metal on this bike to make it look a bit more respectable. sunny

You need a lot of elbow grease, a big box of steel wool pads and you can use brushes like this: My Bike will not start End-brush-steel-wire


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My Bike will not start Frog15My Bike will not start Logo2101986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML GT2 sidecar, 1999 K1200lt/Hannigan Astro Sport sidecar.
    

23Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Thu Aug 27, 2009 8:09 am

MikeK100

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Crazy Frog
What is this elbow grease ? Can I buy it locally?

My mum always said you just need elbow grease, apparently they had shed loads of it in her youth, just roll your sleeves up and use some elbow grease. I never could find the tin, I looked all over the house for it as a child and when I was tired of looking I would sit staring at the television in the hope that I would see it advertised so at least I knew what it looked like.

She used to say to me...." You won't find it sitting there watching the TV, I said back to her " Is that a clue" This was usually followed by a clip round the ear. I had a confusing youth spent looking for that elusive tin.

:pirat:

    

24Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Thu Aug 27, 2009 5:00 pm

Crazy Frog

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MikeK100 wrote:Crazy Frog
What is this elbow grease ? Can I buy it locally?
:pirat:

Mike,

I guess that you didn't have internet when you grew up affraid .

Elbow grease comes in different forms and container shapes:
The liquid form
My Bike will not start Elbowg10
or the paste
My Bike will not start Manly110

Now it's time to start cleaning.

I also use products to clean aluminum rims on cars. Usually, these products contain acid and have to be rinced right away.

Bert


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My Bike will not start Frog15My Bike will not start Logo2101986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML GT2 sidecar, 1999 K1200lt/Hannigan Astro Sport sidecar.
    

25Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Thu Aug 27, 2009 6:57 pm

MikeK100

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Bert

I am glad to see that such a well talked about but rarely seen product has a tin for the mans stuff...

The womens elbow grease is in drop form, I guess we men need to smother the product on in a manly way perhaps with the aid of a power tool (with fast speed setting and hammer switch) whilst the ladies just add a drop to a bucket of water and a light sponge.

You are right I come from a time before the internet, a time when if you wanted help with your bike problems you just asked your dad and with a 1/2 inch spanner he could fix anything from your toy car to your first real car and everything in between. A time when people fixed things and knew how to...................hey are you guys here from the past? Have I reached into the internet connection to 1960's.

It would make a very cool film and we now have a script......just need £3millionquid to get it started! bounce bounce

Who would be in the leading role ? cheers

    

26Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Thu Aug 27, 2009 7:01 pm

MikeK100

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I learned one thing through my problem and it is one that everyone should take note of, the thing everyone here tells you and on any other forums.

This tip will cure most of your problems.

When you first get your bike, take apart and clean every connection on your bike. Clean them and add a small amount of vaseline it will save you a lot of trouble later.

Clean...clean...and protect those connections because pound to a pinch of salt that will be the problem.

    

27Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Thu Aug 27, 2009 8:12 pm

Crazy Frog

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MikeK100 wrote:I learned one thing through my problem and it is one that everyone should take note of, the thing everyone here tells you and on any other forums.

This tip will cure most of your problems.

When you first get your bike, take apart and clean every connection on your bike. Clean them and add a small amount of vaseline it will save you a lot of trouble later.

Clean...clean...and protect those connections because pound to a pinch of salt that will be the problem.

Back to your elbow grease?
Clean Clean Clean..... Your wife must be a good coach Very Happy

Yes we are things of the past. We reverse engineering in order to comprehend problems. We try to fix it too!
Just check the poll that I started. We are people mostly born in the early 60s or before.
I learned so much from my father. A smart guy who did not have the opportunity to go to school because of the war. He was a maintenance person (Jack of all trades, master of none) working for the power corporation. At 50 years old he decided to learn electronic on its own. This was just for fun as he never expected to be promoted for this effort.
The best thing that he thought me was learn, be interested, and work hard. Becoming rich is not the purpose, being happy and proud of your accomplishment is the goal.
Yes fixing a toy with a 1/2" spanner is the best education that you can pass to your kids. Sharing the knowledge and interest is the key.

We are mostly old geezers but smart geezers.

Cheers

Bert


__________________________________________________
My Bike will not start Frog15My Bike will not start Logo2101986 k75, 1985 K100rt, 1985 K100rt/EML GT2 sidecar, 1999 K1200lt/Hannigan Astro Sport sidecar.
    

28Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Fri Aug 28, 2009 3:25 am

K-BIKE

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If you are saying you get a small voltage across the switch contacts that is one issue, the second of it going to zero when you push the button is correct with tthe measurement across the switch it should go to zero when you push the button. Next question is why is it so low?
Have you traced backwards to see whenre the voltage drops from 12 volts down to 2 volts?
Regards,
K-BIKE

    

29Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:41 am

MikeK100

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Hi K-Bike
Thanks you were spot on with your logical approach, if you look at the top of the picture in this thread of me eating in celebration, you will see a thumbnail picture of the offending connection.

Phew! My bike is up and running and I just loved the moment when it sprung into life.....thanks for your help.

    

30Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Fri Aug 28, 2009 5:57 am

MikeK100

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Bert
You are so right, I came off the chassis production line in 1953 I was the fifth model out (youngest). By the time they got to producing my model they had perfected all the little faults they had built into the other models Very Happy .

I remember my dad showing me how to take the dynamo out of his 1950's sit up and beg Ford, taking out the brushes and either cleaning them lightly with fine sand paper or replacing them. Also cleaning the carbon build up between the small coils of copper wire. Setting up the contact points so that the spark would be ok. Adjusting the tappet clearance and fixing the brakes. On really cold wintry days I would be asked to go and crank the old car over using the starter handle. Being shown how to hold onto the handle so that if it sprang back it would not break my thumb.....and failing that pushing the car off down the road for a bump start. Cold but looking back some of the happiest days of my life...kismet

It is probably why I still just get stuck in and start jobs without reading a manual, my dad gave me the confidence to try in the first place.....sometimes we had to push but this was not seen as a failure, just a success if the engine started and my dad remembered to put a clothes peg on the choke pull to hold it out bounce .

I remember when my kids were young and I spent a day with them trying to fix an old computer they were amazed that I would open up the mystery box and several hours later it was running again. They have done the same many times and they are both now very good at messing about with computers.

Reading books is great but there is no better way than rolling up your sleeves and having a go at it. How many times have you said " The engineer who made this thing has never thought about working on it or he would have not made it that way?

    

31Back to top Go down   My Bike will not start Empty Re: My Bike will not start Fri Aug 28, 2009 6:00 am

MikeK100

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To anyone reading this that is a bit scared to have a go, I suggest they buy an old K100 this bike is a fantastic piece of engineering that you can work on and the parts are easily available. I have had a couple of Honda Pan Europeans and trust me the K100 is a far better bike to ride and work on.

    

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